Thread Rating:
  • 0 Vote(s) - 0 Average
  • 1
  • 2
  • 3
  • 4
  • 5
Polarizer on Samyang 14mm f/2.8
#1
Hi everybody!

I want to buy a Samyang 14mm f/2.8 to shoot landscapes, but...there is a big but:

is there any way to use a polarizer filter?

Without a polarizer I guess I can have lot of troubles in that kind of photography, so I'm trying to know if there is a solution.

Any help? <img src='http://forum.photozone.de/public/style_emoticons/<#EMO_DIR#>/unsure.gif' class='bbc_emoticon' alt='Big Grin' />
#2
[quote name='Mr Korn Flakes' timestamp='1283941650' post='2582']

Hi everybody!

I want to buy a Samyang 14mm f/2.8 to shoot landscapes, but...there is a big but:

is there any way to use a polarizer filter?

Without a polarizer I guess I can have lot of troubles in that kind of photography, so I'm trying to know if there is a solution.

Any help? <img src='http://forum.photozone.de/public/style_emoticons/<#EMO_DIR#>/unsure.gif' class='bbc_emoticon' alt='Big Grin' />

[/quote]

Polarizers on very wide lenses? Why do you feel you need one? Polarized light is very directional... so the wider a lens, the more variation you will get. Meaning, you will get very [color="#FF0000"]UN[/color]even skies, which will be very distractive.



And obviously... no filter can be mounted on this lens anyway. But the question remains: Why would you want to (pol-filter on 14mm...)?



[color="#FF0000"]**edit: Yes indeed, Markus. UNeven I meant. Thanks![/color]
#3
[quote name='Brightcolours' timestamp='1283943394' post='2583']Meaning, you will get very even skies, which will be very distractive. [/quote]



I'm sure you meant uneven here, didn't you?



Fully agree, for landscape use, a polarizer is not a good idea on an ultra wide angle lens.



There are other usages, though, where a polarizer might be helpful (to reduce reflections, for example).



There's a filter holder by Lee, designed for the Nikkor AF-S 14-24. It may fit the Samyang, too, but then you'd maybe end up with filter equipment more expensive than the lens <img src='http://forum.photozone.de/public/style_emoticons/<#EMO_DIR#>/wink.gif' class='bbc_emoticon' alt='Big Grin' />



-- Markus
Editor
opticallimits.com

#4
[quote name='Brightcolours' timestamp='1283943394' post='2583']

Polarizers on very wide lenses? Why do you feel you need one? Polarized light is very directional... so the wider a lens, the more variation you will get. Meaning, you will get very [color="#FF0000"]UN[/color]even skies, which will be very distractive.



And obviously... no filter can be mounted on this lens anyway. But the question remains: Why would you want to (pol-filter on 14mm...)?



[color="#FF0000"]**edit: Yes indeed, Markus. UNeven I meant. Thanks![/color]

[/quote]



If a user wants to use this lens on APS-C, then 14mm is not ultra-wide (equivalent to 21mm on film).

(This is a compelling lens in APS-C since most lenses of similar focal length are very slow or very pricey.)



21mm is a bit wider than I would want to consistently use with a polarizer, but I've been able to get pleasing results with a polarizer on 24mm lens (film), so perhaps someone with more skill or imagination or determination could find use for one on a 21mm (equiv.) lens.



Example 1, 24mm lens (on 35mm film) Portrait:

[center][Image: p1001825917-4.jpg][/center]



Example 2, 24mm lens (on 35mm film) Landscape:

[center][Image: p644716852-4.jpg][/center]



Yes, the sky is uneven in the second example. But by carefully positioning the clouds on the right-side of the yellow-line <img src='http://forum.photozone.de/public/style_emoticons/<#EMO_DIR#>/wink.gif' class='bbc_emoticon' alt='Big Grin' /> I was able to somewhat mask the effect in the sky. More importantly, it cut the glare off of the road and foliage. Here is a the same scene without polarizer for comparison:

[ATTACHMENT NOT FOUND]



Getting back on topic, like Brightcolours I also have nothing useful to contribute to the original poster's question about how to mount a filter to it. But if using it with APS-C there might be a way (i.e. DIY trial and error) to mount a circular filter to a tube that slipped over the lens.
#5
[quote name='Mr Korn Flakes' timestamp='1283941650' post='2582']

Hi everybody!

I want to buy a Samyang 14mm f/2.8 to shoot landscapes, but...there is a big but:

is there any way to use a polarizer filter?

Without a polarizer I guess I can have lot of troubles in that kind of photography, so I'm trying to know if there is a solution.

Any help? <img src='http://forum.photozone.de/public/style_emoticons/<#EMO_DIR#>/unsure.gif' class='bbc_emoticon' alt='Big Grin' />

[/quote]



I just bought one (14mm lens under Bower name but still the same lens), and put it through some pretty extreme variations in environment and lighting conditions on its first outing this weekend. I also use a 24 tilt shift and have the Cokin X-Pro filters for it including the polarizer (12 centimeters across), and even with this large filter you can see the edges of it when hand-holding in front of the 14, and you get a pretty bad reflection off the filter anyways because of the distance to the lens hood petals. To use the universal adapter you would have to cut the two larger petals down to the height of the front element, and even then you wouldn't have a secure fit because the plastic petals are quite flexible.

That being said, I had no problems with the lens in terms of colour saturation or unreasonable flair in harsh lighting conditions, and did use split neutral density filters since they easily covered the angle of view and I could block the stray light coming from behind them because they are square and larger than the polarizer, and because I was using it in flat lighting. The only real problem for me was the front element was fogging badly as I descended from the alpine back in to the forest. Granted there was a lot of rain too and I SOAKED the lens, however I still didn't have the same problem with the 24 it its smaller element.



I did have a few images with water in them up in the alpine, but I just used the reflections as part of the image rather than try and get rid of them like I might with a polarizer. I am attaching two links to photographs taken with this lens. One is from the 5D MarkII and is uncropped so you will see the whole image with some levels adjustment and sharpening and how it performs in harsh light with blue sky. The second image is cropped, and I was clowning around trying to make it look like it had a high dynamic range but I have a ways to go, however the width is the whole frame of the 14mm on a 40D using a two stop hard-step neutral density filter (17cm x 13cm) to darken the sky a little like you might get with a polarizer.



5D II image un-cropped [url="http://xtj9sa.blu.livefilestore.com/y1pV8nXJjHxOg1PLFjic0phiB5Gp_izZP_bRjb1PSuJaesYH4C6JW0_w6jwopt2Ffip5A6KCricXR26MX6eJ1JgwuwAIJXtv8uQ/14mm_uncropped_levels_sharpened.jpg?psid=1"]here[/url] (only for a few days though).

40D cropped to 2.39:1 [url="http://public.blu.livefilestore.com/y1p-0XGx51QNOeICcToCztr7znA1SMycTBru0zR_BesC_BuPw8vKHyzmQcBJDaS9viKxSEhHJ93wXKH57mEOZDo2g/14mm_cropped_levels_40D.jpg?psid=1"]here[/url] (only for a few days though).
#6
[quote name='Symple' timestamp='1283961682' post='2587']

I just bought one (14mm lens under Bower name but still the same lens), and put it through some pretty extreme variations in environment and lighting conditions on its first outing this weekend. I also use a 24 tilt shift and have the Cokin X-Pro filters for it including the polarizer (12 centimeters across), and even with this large filter you can see the edges of it when hand-holding in front of the 14, and you get a pretty bad reflection off the filter anyways because of the distance to the lens hood petals. To use the universal adapter you would have to cut the two larger petals down to the height of the front element, and even then you wouldn't have a secure fit because the plastic petals are quite flexible.

That being said, I had no problems with the lens in terms of colour saturation or unreasonable flair in harsh lighting conditions, and did use split neutral density filters since they easily covered the angle of view and I could block the stray light coming from behind them because they are square and larger than the polarizer, and because I was using it in flat lighting. The only real problem for me was the front element was fogging badly as I descended from the alpine back in to the forest. Granted there was a lot of rain too and I SOAKED the lens, however I still didn't have the same problem with the 24 it its smaller element.



I did have a few images with water in them up in the alpine, but I just used the reflections as part of the image rather than try and get rid of them like I might with a polarizer. I am attaching two links to photographs taken with this lens. One is from the 5D MarkII and is uncropped so you will see the whole image with some levels adjustment and sharpening and how it performs in harsh light with blue sky. The second image is cropped, and I was clowning around trying to make it look like it had a high dynamic range but I have a ways to go, however the width is the whole frame of the 14mm on a 40D using a two stop hard-step neutral density filter (17cm x 13cm) to darken the sky a little like you might get with a polarizer.



5D II image un-cropped [url="http://xtj9sa.blu.livefilestore.com/y1pV8nXJjHxOg1PLFjic0phiB5Gp_izZP_bRjb1PSuJaesYH4C6JW0_w6jwopt2Ffip5A6KCricXR26MX6eJ1JgwuwAIJXtv8uQ/14mm_uncropped_levels_sharpened.jpg?psid=1"]here[/url] (only for a few days though).

40D cropped to 2.39:1 [url="http://public.blu.livefilestore.com/y1p-0XGx51QNOeICcToCztr7znA1SMycTBru0zR_BesC_BuPw8vKHyzmQcBJDaS9viKxSEhHJ93wXKH57mEOZDo2g/14mm_cropped_levels_40D.jpg?psid=1"]here[/url] (only for a few days though).

[/quote]





Thanks a lot, now my ideas are clearer! <img src='http://forum.photozone.de/public/style_emoticons/<#EMO_DIR#>/smile.gif' class='bbc_emoticon' alt='Big Grin' />

Just one question: was the ND filter handheld?
#7
[quote name='Mr Korn Flakes' timestamp='1283967932' post='2589']

Thanks a lot, now my ideas are clearer! <img src='http://forum.photozone.de/public/style_emoticons/<#EMO_DIR#>/smile.gif' class='bbc_emoticon' alt='Big Grin' />

Just one question: was the ND filter handheld?

[/quote]



Yes, I handhold the neutral density filters with this lens. I have a full set of Cokin X-Pro filters, and several Singh-Ray in the X-Pro size, and I would just get the Cokin versions. They are just as good, a little thicker, and MUCH less expensive. On this shot with the 40D I think I was hand-holding the X120 filter and you can see I came down the grass/sedge too much, but the shadow on the glacier on the other side helps reduce the obviousness (the image is way over processed though).



I processed another photo from the 5D II, and this time was a little more careful with the levels. It looks mostly the same as the other, but it is a different image with more processing to simulate a ploarizer. I shot this on aperture priority at f/8 and took out all the insects that look like sensor dust too.



14mm on 5D II to look like polarized without filter [url="http://xtj9sa.blu.livefilestore.com/y1pn8pcvifbX21YL7LWv1msFXspwtWp-wp0jbsQ75nLGh-nCC9XVyeEBLP-UMX-gnAv6T3iedYEAvdC1v1e4f48DlkE9E5KfHxg/14mm_uncropped_adjusted_5DII.jpg?psid=1"]here[/url] (for a little while only)
#8
[quote name='Symple' timestamp='1283969039' post='2590']

Yes, I handhold the neutral density filters with this lens. I have a full set of Cokin X-Pro filters, and several Singh-Ray in the X-Pro size, and I would just get the Cokin versions. They are just as good, a little thicker, and MUCH less expensive. On this shot with the 40D I think I was hand-holding the X120 filter and you can see I came down the grass/sedge too much, but the shadow on the glacier on the other side helps reduce the obviousness (the image is way over processed though).



I processed another photo from the 5D II, and this time was a little more careful with the levels. It looks mostly the same as the other, but it is a different image with more processing to simulate a ploarizer. I shot this on aperture priority at f/8 and took out all the insects that look like sensor dust too.



14mm on 5D II to look like polarized without filter [url="http://xtj9sa.blu.livefilestore.com/y1pn8pcvifbX21YL7LWv1msFXspwtWp-wp0jbsQ75nLGh-nCC9XVyeEBLP-UMX-gnAv6T3iedYEAvdC1v1e4f48DlkE9E5KfHxg/14mm_uncropped_adjusted_5DII.jpg?psid=1"]here[/url] (for a little while only)

[/quote]



Ok, no more doubts!

Thanks a lot for your answers <img src='http://forum.photozone.de/public/style_emoticons/<#EMO_DIR#>/smile.gif' class='bbc_emoticon' alt='Big Grin' />
#9
[quote name='dave9t5' timestamp='1283950593' post='2585']

If a user wants to use this lens on APS-C, then 14mm is not ultra-wide (equivalent to 21mm on film).

(This is a compelling lens in APS-C since most lenses of similar focal length are very slow or very pricey.)



[/quote]



I have added two more lousy photos that are from almost the same spot. The 40D was on the ground though and to the left and slightly forward of the 5DII shot with the same lens. You can use Mount Sir Donald in the background as a reference between the two images that have not been cropped.



40D [url="http://xtj9sa.blu.livefilestore.com/y1p6RxhxVTu_Grarrncga8QtxJ1hKe4HoW3MK7DCPT0hS5EYlZzic-jvLvvPagY9JTLBUrh_EsX-0NQS_LL1a2IxA9hFlTuEWm9/40D_14mm_uncropped.jpg?psid=1"]here[/url].

5DII [url="http://xtj9sa.blu.livefilestore.com/y1pb6RNMNQrjtryBaVbD7ynI2MXalN1qCHogbtJTAuqqoZALwtXhrQyeozGifPa5ChcLop0WY_h1i4BRqvPXlDr__xAfvKAHPIJ/5DII_14mm_uncropped.jpg?psid=1"]here[/url].
  


Forum Jump:


Users browsing this thread:
1 Guest(s)