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davidmanze

hi guys,

              I just been doing my " photographic equipment accounts" on how much I've spent on my current gear, which is since moving on from Pentax and it's range of lenses,  (I lost a heap of money there).

    Nikon came, both FF and APSc, not wanting to lose as much money as on the K mounts new lenses, I bought almost entirely second hand gear (apart from the Tamron 150-600 and the 14mm Samyang). the plan being to be able to resell without loss!

Amongst these were lots of AFD lenses which I find good enough for my use, even though dated, they are still mostly available new today, (AF85D 1.8 discontinued) 

 In the end with my current gear and (forgetting the couple of Pentax lenses I'm struggling to sell) I've spent €7,500 on my current bodies and lenses not including accessories etc.

  This somewhat alarming figure is cushioned however by the money I would have spent if I had bought new. Out of the sixteen S/H F mount lenses including a teleconverter I purchased, the resulting bill for new would have been an additional  â‚¬3,980!

  That doesn't include the Nikor 500mm ED F4D (I paid €2,500) for which the new and better VR version stands at around €10K!

 All in all I got a lot of "bang for buck" with what I bought albeit still "loads of money". I know I haven't the exotic 105mm 1.4 wide angle primes and the latest Nikon zooms but that isn't really my sphere anyway.

 

  So what's your take on buying or building a system using S/H lenses, I know here on a lens site the latest tends to be the greatest and often is, but how many here buy new; S/H current lenses; or older generation optics?

I love second hand lenses pretty much everything.

 

There are only a few cases I'd buy brand new lenses.

 

-A newly released lens that I've got to have. Even though I'm not a professional photographer, I shoot a lot of interiors for my work. Luckily, my boss is also a photographer and he has quite a good arsenal. Last year we bought the Canon EF 11-24/4. If I were earning money directly from my interior shots, I'd buy that lens instantly for myself, as soon as it came out. Wouldn't even hesitate or wait a few months for a used one. I also bought most of my APS-C Sony NEX lenses that way. 

 

-I know that I won't be losing much if I sell it soon. I don't live in the US or EU and some stuff are much cheaper there (Some are much cheaper here). I've bought a lot of lenses while traveling and asked friends who live in the US to bring me some with them. Even if I decide to sell those after a few months, I can pretty much get what I paid for them new by selling them here. I sometimes even make money that way.

 

-Sometimes the price difference isn't that great. Zony 55/1.8 brand new costs about 800$ here and it's about 600$ used. Also keep in mind that I get 2 years warranty if I buy it new, unlike most other countries. For Fuji lenses, it's 3 years which is even better. Moreover, I can finance it with my credit card and pay 100$ per month for 8 months.

 

-Sometimes you can't even find it used. If I wanted to have a Batis right now, there is one used for sale in my country. One. And it's not even in the same city that I live in. The price difference isn't that much neither.

 

-If I were a professional, I could've gotten tax deductions from brand new items. Can't do that with second hand.

 

-Some lenses fail much more often and I'd like to have every single day of warranty to back me up in that case. 55/1.8, I'm looking at you again.

 

-I can buy it online, try return it and get a full refund. Never done that though.

 

-I get about 18% of the price back if I buy something while traveling, Tax Free shopping is fun. Sometimes it ends up cheaper than used, especially if you also catch a deal. 

 

-I've seen ridiculous deals, especially local. Some people would cry if I post a list here so I won't but it includes 50% off on some Zeiss lenses.

 

-Fujifilm outlet here sells store demos for used market price for full 3 year warranty. Add financing to that and you're literally looking at the best of both worlds.

Off the top of my head, out of the last 24 lenses that I aquired, 4 were new.  Many of the 20 were $20 or less.  Most were manual focus.  Two of the new ones I bought were Canon "L" lenses.  Despite the cost, I like new lenses the best.  But 2 of the lenses I bought were $3, more than one were free including Asahi Pentax 55mm f/1.8 (I consider a good lens).  I got an Asahi smc 50mm f/1.4 for $10 dollars.  I bought an Asahi 135mm f/2.5 for $25 on eBay.  Most reviews say it is only "An average consumer grade lens"  It is coated, but not multi-coated.  I consider it to be nothing short of excellent.  But you know, one "expert" calls it consumer grade glass, and the we can all buy one for $25 for at least 20 years!  Thank you experts!

 

I don't really like manual focus.  And I appreciate modern technology, and how easy it makes shooting.  But a can't resist a cheap lens!  Just how bad can it be?  I've learned you can almost always get a great photo with a cheap lens.  It's just the percentage of great photos can be very low!

 

The two "L" lenses are probably a whole new level for me.  I haven't gotten used to the "L" level performance yet.  Do you know what a springtail is?  It is an arthropod normally 0.5 to 2mm in length.  A challenge even for a macro lens.  I took a photo of one with the EF 135 f/2L.  No tube.  No diopter.  Just it's max mag of ~ 1:5.  It was a good picture!  Basically, I'm in shock!  More L lenses coming?  Probably.  I mean this is just a hobby.  But how do you go back after this?

davidmanze

Hi Arthur,

                Sounds like you just can't resist a bargain!   I'm of the same vain!

     What brand are you shooting with your Pentax lenses, Canon with an adapter?    I must admit I prefer AF where catching the moment that presents itself is imperative, MF is fine for slower stuff where you can take your time, macro for example.

  A lot of recent lenses from Nikon and Canon are around a grand a pop at release, Sigma and Tamron have both upped their game and their offerings are not far behind, great lenses no doubt, but when you can find similar focal lengths and max. aperture albeit lesser performance for a 1/10th of the price, you really do need to produce results to justify the price difference (and mostly I can't justify it), not to mention the size of this modern glass.

   The most fun glass I have bought is the Helios 44-2 and the Pentacon 135mm, not quality glass by modern standards, they bring novel rendering qualities to the table, their bargain factor being another one of them.

Well buying used can be a great way to save money if you know what you are doing and know the lenses very well and you know  how to detect lemons. Otherwise it is an expensive lottery

Buying lenses because they are cheap, makes sense only if you are going to use them, otherwise it is pointless, the only lens I bought because it was cheap is Canon EFs 18-55 STM, it came with the camera I bought used and practically I got it for free (750D plus manfrotto tripod, plus camera bag, plus 70-300IS plus 18-55 IS STM for 500$ couldn't refuse the package 

In the early days EF lenses, especially 3rd party ones, sucked.  They were made of plastic, had noisy motors.  The apertures would get stuck, some times the plastic mount would just break off.  The focusing parts (the slots, and bearings and grooves) were made of plastic, and parts would just break.  You'd hear them rattling around in the lens.

 

And then there were the all metal manual focus lenses...that never broke.  Looked like works of art...Were fast and compact. 

 

I have one thing in common with Klaus:  I am a lens tester!  But in my case, all I can say is almost any lens exceeds my skill as a  photographer.  I've tried currency, I've tried peacock feathers, I've tried birds and flowers.  If you are careful and you compensate for exposure and color balance and motion.  Almost any lens (at least that I would buy) can come close to matching any other lens. 

 

There is not much gamble in a $10 Asahi 50/1.4.  But the truth is it's really not that much better than EF 50/1.8.  I fell into the trap of wanting to find the ultimate 50mm.  That is a bit pointless, since they are all good.  But I have a lot of them so I, of course tried.  What can I say?  It keeps me out of trouble.  But if you want the verdict?  Every time I test them I rate them in a different order.  It comes down to me, not the lens!  Plus I don't shell out for the really expensive ones.  Add to that that I like character (flaws) that certain lenses have.  I think Dave said the Jupiter 8 renders harsh.  But that is perfect for old broken down buildings.  I have a Meyer-Gorlitz that is the same.


@ Dave:  Heh, heh, heh...would you believe I have a Helios 103 on the way from Russia?  53/1.8 if I recall.  Hey!  Russia needs hard currency.  Consider it international friendship! 

 

Back to Toni-a.  I bagged a Canon XT with memory card and EF 28-105 IS USM for $40.  I only wanted the lens, but the 8 MP camera is still better than any MILC.  (Sorry, I couldn't resist).

I should add I actually do take chances on used lenses:

Tamron SP 180mm Macro, Tamron SP 90mm Macro, Canon EF-S 60mm Macro, Canon 50mm f1.8 Mark I were all bought used.  They are definitely some of my best lenses, and I got pretty lucky.  I bought them all on eBay, so I can't pretend that wasn't a bit of a gamble. 

 

I also, pretty much exclusively use the grey market to buy new lenses.  (Meaning not from an authorized US distributor). 

 

It is your basic cost to benefit scenario.  It all depends on the price difference.  I can't tell you how many times I see a used lens selling for more than a brand new one.  What are you going to do?

davidmanze

Quote:I should add I actually do take chances on used lenses:

Tamron SP 180mm Macro, Tamron SP 90mm Macro, Canon EF-S 60mm Macro, Canon 50mm f1.8 Mark I were all bought used.  They are definitely some of my best lenses, and I got pretty lucky.  I bought them all on eBay, so I can't pretend that wasn't a bit of a gamble. 

 

I also, pretty much exclusively use the grey market to buy new lenses.  (Meaning not from an authorized US distributor). 

 

It is your basic cost to benefit scenario.  It all depends on the price difference.  I can't tell you how many times I see a used lens selling for more than a brand new one.  What are you going to do?
 

 

    The more you write the more I wonder if we are not related somehow, I think pretty much the same way!

Like your "keeps me out of trouble" line.  Big Grin

 

   Yeah, I take plenty of chances with S/H stuff, but frankly I've had just as many de-centered lenses buying new if not more, you do have the chance to return them though and sellers have changed their policy for the better, many here would only return the lens to the maker, so you bought a lens, tested it, only to find you have a two month wait while it's being seen to. Now I only buy from the big sites.

   I buy mostly S/H fixed focals, you run less of a risk when there are dozens of glass elements shifting position, I can say that nearly all the zooms I've ever bought bar two had some sort of centering issue, new were returned/replaced/repaired S/H were resold usually after I'd packed the bayonet to improve them. 

 I buy grey too, the refund or exchange policy is worth it's weight in gold, four greys now, Pentax K3 (Pentax honored their guarantee) Tamron 150-600 was exchange no problem, D750 and the recently exchanged D500. As you say I'm still seeing S/H D750s for more than I paid for it.

  I won't risk another lens from ebay though, one out three is way too risky for me and the sellers are difficult to contact!

 

  I've just googled the Helios 103, is it a Contax bayonet mount?

Yes on Contax RF Bayonet mount.

 

I get the filling it takes a lot less to keep me out of trouble than you (I mean that in a good way).  If you my post where my fairy godmother gave me a Zeiss Contax III Rangefinder, + four Carl Zeiss Jena lenses + extras.  All pre-war.  All serials indicating 1935-1937.  At first I was disappointed because they can't be adapted to a Canon SLR.  Then after much soul searching I decided to find and adapter to MFT.  Well you know the commercially available adapters range from 2-4 hundred dollars and more.  So I looked to Russia for the answer.  I found the Helios for sale with the focusing adapter to MFT. 

 

I am also in the process of trading one of my CZJ RF lenses for a very unusual lens in the EF mount.  Voightander 90mm f/3.5. 

 

Now I am happy if the deal goes through because I will still have a Contax RF series of lenses to try on my friends MFT Olympus.  But more importantly, I have a very interesting lens to try that is made for the Canon EF mount.  In my favorite focal length!

 

Everything is still up in the air.  It was predicted to take a month to get the package from Russia.  Some people do not have the patience for that.  It will be my third from Russia.  All eBay.  All S/H.  I feel like an expectant father waiting for my lenses!

davidmanze

  Sometimes you can have more fun with an old quality lens for little money than an expensive one that you use little, you feel that you've put something into what you are doing.

 

I feel the Otus is really a studio lens....... 

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