[popo]

I have posted this elsewhere which helped narrow down the choices, but I could still use input on any more exotic, uncommon or older lenses I might have overlooked.



Application: close up still life, camera mostly on tripod, shallow DoF.

Host: Must either natively fit Canon EOS or have easily available adapter to do so.



Feature requirements:

f/2.8 or faster. I don't really need any faster as the DoF is already very narrow when close focusing.

Nice bokeh around f/2.8 - I particularly value lack of outlines/nervous look both in front and behind focal plane at any distance. Also LoCa should be very low. I'm not so concerned about non-round aperture or cat's eye effect.

Good sharpness at f/2.8 across most of APS-C image.

No significant focus shift when changing aperture. I often manually aperture-bracket and don't want to waste time refocusing between shots.

At least 1:4 magnification is desirable, I don't need more than 1:2. This may be achieved by additions e.g. using extension tubes. I don't need infinity focus.

MF only is fine.

Can be prime or zoom, although I doubt any zoom will be able to meet these requirements well.



I haven't set a specific budget for this. I'll pay more if it is worth it.



To give an idea of what else I've used in this application:

Canon 35mm f/2: not bad overall as is. I just need a longer focal length and prefer better bokeh.

Canon 85mm f/1.8: Bokeh rather messy and far too easy to get purple fringing on highlights.

Sony 50mm f/1.4: Bokeh could be better (outlines and colour)



Looking around, I think the Zeiss 50mm f/2 macro is the nearest to an ideal lens for the application but I'm not quite convinced on the price/performance balance.



The other common lower cost primes around 50mm are rather unremarkable hence I'm looking to expand the search away from the mass market models.

[Klaus]

[quote name='popo' timestamp='1282994077' post='2270']

I have posted this elsewhere which helped narrow down the choices, but I could still use input on any more exotic, uncommon or older lenses I might have overlooked.



Application: close up still life, camera mostly on tripod, shallow DoF.

Host: Must either natively fit Canon EOS or have easily available adapter to do so.



Feature requirements:

f/2.8 or faster. I don't really need any faster as the DoF is already very narrow when close focusing.

Nice bokeh around f/2.8 - I particularly value lack of outlines/nervous look both in front and behind focal plane at any distance. Also LoCa should be very low. I'm not so concerned about non-round aperture or cat's eye effect.

Good sharpness at f/2.8 across most of APS-C image.

No significant focus shift when changing aperture. I often manually aperture-bracket and don't want to waste time refocusing between shots.

At least 1:4 magnification is desirable, I don't need more than 1:2. This may be achieved by additions e.g. using extension tubes. I don't need infinity focus.

MF only is fine.

Can be prime or zoom, although I doubt any zoom will be able to meet these requirements well.



I haven't set a specific budget for this. I'll pay more if it is worth it.



To give an idea of what else I've used in this application:

Canon 35mm f/2: not bad overall as is. I just need a longer focal length and prefer better bokeh.

Canon 85mm f/1.8: Bokeh rather messy and far too easy to get purple fringing on highlights.

Sony 50mm f/1.4: Bokeh could be better (outlines and colour)



Looking around, I think the Zeiss 50mm f/2 macro is the nearest to an ideal lens for the application but I'm not quite convinced on the price/performance balance.



The other common lower cost primes around 50mm are rather unremarkable hence I'm looking to expand the search away from the mass market models.

[/quote]





As you mentioned - the Zeiss 50/2 is probably the best choice.

The Sigma 70/2.8 APO macro should also be worth a thought.

If you'd like to explore the exciting unknown ... the Leica R Macro-Elmarit 60mm f/2.8 is both very affordable on the used market and supposed to be very good.

There're naturally also longer lenses which might be interesting.

[Klaus]

[quote name='Klaus' timestamp='1282996549' post='2271']

As you mentioned - the Zeiss 50/2 is probably the best choice.

The Sigma 70/2.8 APO macro should also be worth a thought.

If you'd like to explore the exciting unknown ... the Leica R Macro-Elmarit 60mm f/2.8 is both very affordable on the used market and supposed to be very good.

There're naturally also longer lenses which might be interesting.





[/quote]



Oh, and there's of course the Zeiss Makro-Planar-S 60mm f/2.8 in C/Y mount. This one is also pretty affordable in the bay.

[popo]

Thanks for the suggestions. Found some image samples for the Leica and it looks ok so far. Need to find more though. Haven't found any cheap ones in eurozone yet.

[mst]

It's longer than suggested, but have you considered the TS-E 90?



Should fit most of your requirements, when combined with an EF-tube. Not so sure about LoCAs, but than these will be visible to some degree with almost any lens in this range ...



-- Markus

[Klaus]

[quote name='popo' timestamp='1282997701' post='2273']

Thanks for the suggestions. Found some image samples for the Leica and it looks ok so far. Need to find more though. Haven't found any cheap ones in eurozone yet.

[/quote]



They between 400-1200EUR here at ebay.de.

[popo]

[quote name='mst' timestamp='1282998131' post='2274']

It's longer than suggested, but have you considered the TS-E 90?

[/quote]

I think 60mm is about as long as I want to go. 85mm is on the long side already. On similar thoughts I was wondering if the TS-E 45mm would be a possibility too, but haven't had a chance to look it up in detail yet. I know used samples pop up at reasonable prices now and then on that one but I wouldn't get it new...

[popo]

[quote name='Klaus' timestamp='1282998700' post='2275']

They between 400-1200EUR here at ebay.de.

[/quote]

I was suffering from some ebay search fail earlier. I can see more of them now I revised the search terms. Looks like more than one (cosmetic?) version was made? Time for more research...



Edit: well, I'm certainly learning about Leica... turns out they are mount variations so not important to me after all.

[wim]

Let me add my 2 cents worth.



Most of the areas are covered, I think, with Leica-R 60 F/2.8, Zeiss 50 F/2 MP, TS-E 45 F/2.8. One lens not mentioned yet is the 50 F/2.5 CM (Compact Macro). That last lens actually has very good bokeh, both in front of and behind the DoF zone.



I have owned one, but after obtaining the 50L it didn't really get any use anymore, as I could use that for (semi)macro as well with some tubes, with even better bokeh. The 50L comes at a price, however, and potentially focus shift problems, even though mine is fine (no more than 1/6 of DoF shift at most in the danger zone, well within AF specs).



The TS-E 45 is a great lens too in this regard, not in the least because the TS-E lenses all have incredibly good bokeh at any aperture, and the TS-E 45 is no different in this respect. Of course, tilt (and shift) in close-up photography is a very nice advantage, as you can still shoot at fairly large apertures and still maintain DoF there where you need it. Current prices on used specimens are quite favourable, and it is an excellent lens. Very sharp, great rendering, excellent bokeh. And it takes very well to extension tubes and extenders.



The Zeiss 50 F/2 is a good lens, but rather expensive, even used if you can find one. I have no real experience with it, only with the F/1.4.



The Leica is IMO ok, but not special. I own one basically because I hoped I could replace the EF-S 60 Macro with this for use on FF, but I reckon the EF-S 60 Macro is better.



If you'd want to go for a native mount Canon lens, I would recommend the TS-E 45 or Zeiss 50 F/2 if budget is large enough (and TS-E 45 would be my preference in this case), followed by either the EF-S 60 Macro (seeing you own a 7D) or the EF 50 CM, with the EF 50 CM having a distinct advantage with really good bokeh. After that, well, maybe an old Olympus or Pentax 50 mm macro lens. The Leica 60 is rather expensive, and not even considered to be all that great by Leica afficionados.



Bokeh wise I'd rate the TS-E 45 and the 50L ex aequo #1 (for your kind of application), based on pictures the Zeiss probably second, and the 50 CM and Sigma 50 F/1.4 ex aequo third, if that is of any help. From what I have seen so far, there is quite a gap next before any other lens in the good bokeh line-up. This al based on having owned, still owning, or having tested well over 30 lenses in the 40 to 60 mm FL (still own 5, TS-E 45, 50L, C/Y CZ 50 F/1.5, OM Zuiko 50 F/1.4, and Leica-R 60 F/2.8).



Kind regards, Wim

[Guest]

I've not used it myself but from what I've seen the zuiko 50f2 macro is quite good and probably a decent option here.



(the older OM lens in case there is confusion)