[Brightcolours]

[quote name='jenbenn' timestamp='1284844554' post='2900']

I think its established that brightcolours is a brand believer <img src='http://forum.photozone.de/public/style_emoticons/<#EMO_DIR#>/smile.gif' class='bbc_emoticon' alt='' /> Anyway, my windows PC doesnt need strange firewalls, its got one build into windows, which I never need to touch. Anti virus sofware was installed once, and keeps itself up to date. I also have not reinstalled a pc yet. The trouble with pc is that many people install tons of idiotic free or cheap software on their machines which isnt even available for mac. At some point your system is messed up. MY pc has been running everyday for the last three years without any loss in speed or virus problems. IF you keep your system clean and install only quality software, you hardly need to reinstall your system ( at least not if you run vista or windows 7) As far as dirvers are conncerned: well if you never upgrade your hardware, as one would do with a mac, one hardly ever needs to search for drivers on a pc, too.

In the end its a question of money and design. Comparable macs are just far more expensive. I'D also watch out for conncetion options with mac. At least the macbooks suck in this regard. you get just two usb ports of which you can only use one because its build so closely to the other, that any normal memory stick will block the nighbouring port.

[/quote]

Brightcolours is someone with actual EXPERIENCE with a Mac, which you do not have. Brightcolours is also a software developer, who then obviously works with Windows computers as that is what the companies he works/worked for use.

That makes brightcolours someone with both Windows and Mac experience.



So just call Brightcolours informed.



Also, you clearly have no idea about just how much software is available for Mac OS X.



But that is ok, of course. Calling brightcolours a "brand believer" is not ok, and is not true either. Brightcolours is not a Microsoft believer, out of experience.



And what you write about ports on macbooks is plain nonsense. Normally designed usb keys will never block the next port. If you happen to have bought a very weird badly designed USB key, I suggest you blame the key maker. And it will then also post to be a problem on other computers, as there is no such thing as too close spacing of the USB ports on macs.

[mst]

[quote name='jenbenn' timestamp='1284812044' post='2891']

Just a thought: I think with mac RAID is only available in the macpro line, not sure however.[/quote]



Yes, that's correct. Quite obvious since it's the only Mac that takes expansion cards.



[quote name='jenbenn' timestamp='1284812044' post='2891']With windows you can get it in a fairly cost effctive pc.[/quote]



Yes, but if we're talking about low cost RAID controllers (SATA RAID 0/1/10), especially onboard ones, then we're talking about mostly software RAID here. Lots of the work is still done by the CPU. You don't gain much compared to pure software RAID ... which of course is available on the Mac, too.



[quote name='jenbenn' timestamp='1284812044' post='2891']But then tinme machine on mac may be sufficient for you.

[/quote]



Absolutely. But note that we're talking about two very different forms of redundancy here. A RAID keeps your machine running in case of a drive failure (unless we're talking about RAID 0, which is about speed only). However, it will not protect your data in case of accidental deletion, malware activity or filesystem errors. A backup (like Time Machine) will.



-- Markus

[mst]

[quote name='Brightcolours' timestamp='1284850766' post='2902']

And what you write about ports on macbooks is plain nonsense. Normally designed usb keys will never block the next port. If you happen to have bought a very weird badly designed USB key, I suggest you blame the key maker. And it will then also post to be a problem on other computers, as there is no such thing as too close spacing of the USB ports on macs.

[/quote]



Actually jenbenn is right here. I have a current 15" Unibody Macbook Pro and the USB ports are very close to each other. It just takes two normal USB cables or a very thin USB key and a cable. However, I can not fit any two of my USB keys (lots of them, some really narrow and thin ones, too). That's of course also the case with larger USB devices like 3G sticks, which definitely block the second port.



It's not an issue for me, since I hardly ever use two USB devices at the same time and most of my external disks are firewire devices (and can be daisy chained). However, it's certainly something to keep in mind when intending to use more than one USB device on a mobile Mac.



One small correction to jenbenn, though <img src='http://forum.photozone.de/public/style_emoticons/<#EMO_DIR#>/wink.gif' class='bbc_emoticon' alt='' /> The 17" MacBook Pro has 3 USB ports. On the other hand, the Macbook Air only has one.



Talking about the Air: I have to correct myself, too. When I mentioned all current MacBooks can easily be upgraded, I forgot about the Air. That's a fixed machine which you cannot upgrade yourself (neither disk nor RAM).



-- Markus

[sth]

Everything you can do on a Mac you can also do on a PC in one way or another.

Where the both differ a bit is the "how". It's simply two different systems.



My first contact with the Mac world was during a project where I got to use someone else's PowerMac G5 workstation. It was a pretty interesting experience so I decided to purchase a MacBook Pro. The first weeks were really painful because OSX forces you to let go of some old habits and get used to different workflows. In the end, most of it (not all) makes a lot of sense, though. It's still a thing to keep in mind: It takes time to get used to a different system.



What I like about OSX is the consistency of the UI and usability stuff like common keyboard shortcuts which work exactly the same in any application (as long as it's not made by Adobe <img src='http://forum.photozone.de/public/style_emoticons/<#EMO_DIR#>/wink.gif' class='bbc_emoticon' alt='' /> ). Things like color management or automated backups are very simple to set up and you almost never have to install drivers, especially not for printers unless it's someting exotic.



The system itself is also quite easy to manage and maintain: Basically you don't have to do anything. But if you dig deeper, you find a well-structured and transparent system: Human-readable config files instead of a registry, Applications that are self-contained bundles which can easily be moved/copied/deleted whatever way you want them (unless they're made by Adobe, of course) and most applications don't even have an installer, installation is just drag'n'drop. There's also very little chance for version conflicts, shared library (DLL) problems etc.



The hardware is more expensive and some of Apple's design choices are a bit questionable. There's also very little choice in terms of components and price (no real low-end models). On the plus side, the aluminium stuff is usually very well built and quite durable, although my impression is that the same can not be said for their plastic devices.





In the end, it all comes down to personal preference. Again: There's basically nothing you can do on a Mac that you can't do on a PC as well in one way or another (nothing except developing iPhone applications <img src='http://forum.photozone.de/public/style_emoticons/<#EMO_DIR#>/tongue.gif' class='bbc_emoticon' alt='' /> ).





Just my €0,02...

[Guest]

[quote name='Brightcolours' timestamp='1284850766' post='2902']





So just call Brightcolours informed.



And what you write about ports on macbooks is plain nonsense. Normally designed usb keys will never block the next port. If you happen to have bought a very weird badly designed USB key, I suggest you blame the key maker. And it will then also post to be a problem on other computers, as there is no such thing as too close spacing of the USB ports on macs.

[/quote]



Actually you are very cute, brightcolors. You claim to have all the practical experience but you are satisfied with being limited to buying the low end micro usb sticks? When I tried to print from my sandisk cruzer stick on my macbook, I discovered I coudnt even plug the printer in simultanouslyw ith the stick. I hope you agree that the sandsik cruzer is not not a weird, badly designed stick but rather a professional tool that you buy if you need speed and durability.

Sorry, I love the apple products for their build quality and looks, but price-perfomance wise I am not convinced and some of their interface decisions, like the usb ports, are actually quite bad.

[Brightcolours]

[quote name='jenbenn' timestamp='1284887710' post='2912']

Actually you are very cute, brightcolors. You claim to have all the practical experience but you are satisfied with being limited to buying the low end micro usb sticks? When I tried to print from my sandisk cruzer stick on my macbook, I discovered I coudnt even plug the printer in simultanouslyw ith the stick. I hope you agree that the sandsik cruzer is not not a weird, badly designed stick but rather a professional tool that you buy if you need speed and durability.

Sorry, I love the apple products for their build quality and looks, but price-perfomance wise I am not convinced and some of their interface decisions, like the usb ports, are actually quite bad.

[/quote]

What is high end to a sandisk USB stick? You find those in the 5 euros discount basket just like other USB disks.



So the cruzer is badly designed? Ok. Then why did you buy that one? Like I said, blame the USB stick maker. And you, the buyer of that product.



Now for some facts:

Notice the spacing of the USB ports on this macbook pro:





Notice the spacing of the USB ports on this HP pavilion:





Notice the spacing of the USB ports on this Sony Vaio:





And on this one:





Notice the spacing of the USB ports on this Acer Travelmate:





As I said.... if you buy a badly designed USB key, it will block ports on any laptop. Silly to claim that to be an Apple design problem.



So do yourself a favor, and throw away badly designed USB memory keys. They are dirt cheap, not really a reason to not buy a certain laptop or computer, now is it?

Just get one of the 1000's that are well designed:















It really is not hard to find memory sticks that do not pose a problem to your notebook ports. And Memory sticks are dirt cheap after all.

[Guest]

sweet. sandisk cruzer is 60 Euros .....and not in any way similar to the disposable crap you show here. Do your resaearch before posting nonsense. Sorry but my demands to storage security and speed seem differnt to yours. IF you are content with the sticks you show here fine, but dont call the higher quality product badly designed.

(http://www.amazon.de/SanDisk-Cruzer-Contour-U3-16GB/dp/B0015UBSKA/ref=sr_1_10?ie=UTF8&s=ce-de&qid=1284894104&sr=8-10)

And you are right, there are some pc notebooks which are just as bad as apple. Its just that most PC notebooks offer a third usb port on the opposite side of the machine, so at least two ports can be used at the same time. apple macbook pro 15 " only offers two, making it just one usable.(if you look at your own pic here you will see that the sony book has THREE usb portson one side, which gives also at least two usable ports).

I am not bashing apple here, but if one needs to use more than one external usb device, apple is certinly not the optimum product here. In addition I have to say that I cannot understand why such an expensive product as mac book 15 " offers less usb ports than many pc books which are several hundred euros cheaper . This is just a bad design decision from a usability point of view and for me peronsally, an argument not to buy a macbook again.

[Brightcolours]

[quote name='jenbenn' timestamp='1284894219' post='2916']

sandisk cruzer is 60 Euros (.....and not in any way similar to the disposable crap you show here. Sorry but my demands to storage security and speed seem differnt to yours. (http://www.amazon.de/SanDisk-Cruzer-Contour-U3-16GB/dp/B0015UBSKA/ref=sr_1_10?ie=UTF8&s=ce-de&qid=1284894104&sr=8-10) And you are right, there are some pc notebooks which are just as bad as apple.Its just that most PC notebooks offer a third usb port on the opposite side of the machine, so at least two ports can be used at the same time. apple only offers two, making it just one usable.

[/quote]

There is nothing particularly speedy about that sandisk, it is just a bit strangely expensive. They are not even more "secure".

So if you "demand" things that are not needed... sure, go ahead. I will just use fast and speedy well designed USB keys that pose no problem to PC and notebook ports, and never lose any files. No problem.

[Guest]

[quote name='Brightcolours' timestamp='1284894842' post='2917']

There is nothing particularly speedy about that sandisk, it is just a bit strangely expensive. They are not even more "secure".



[/quote]

your qualified in-depth-knowledge is admirable. I wish I had consulted you before I invested in such a redundant product.



btw I dont "demand things that are not needed". What is needed cannot be determined in general. And it certainly is not your business to determine what anybody else needs. All I am saying is that if one needs multiple usable usb ports, apple macbooks may not be the preferred product to buy. If you need to use less external usb devices than I do, a macbook may make sense for you. After all we answered to this thread to help somebody decide. He needs to weigh the arguments for and against apple for himself. There is no point in saying that the arguments against apple are invalid because you dont see it that way. I have a macbook and I wouldnt buy a new one if this breaks, simply because the lack of more usb ports drives me nuts and because I discovered that there is no practical advantage of a macbook over a higher end and cheaper pc laptop, if you dont need to fidle with things but just work on it. Other people may think differntly.

[Guest]

[quote name='jenbenn' timestamp='1284844554' post='2900']

I think its established that brightcolours is a brand believer <img src='http://forum.photozone.de/public/style_emoticons/<#EMO_DIR#>/smile.gif' class='bbc_emoticon' alt='' />[/quote]



That´s true, he surely is.