[toni-a]

Hi all,

bought 100 mm macro as a macro and portrait lens.

the lens is extremely sharp, merely flawless, I was happy with it, but I want more.



Only flaw is bokeh, i want a better bokeh.

on close focus distance (less than 2 meters) bokeh is amazing but when distance is longer things aren't that good, bokeh is still fine but not as good as I want.

so I am considering replacing it, since this is my mainly shooting.

my options

Canon 85mm f1.8 only if it manages to outperform the 100mm macro

Canon 100mm f2.8 macro L IS seems an obvious choice till now.

Canon 70-200f2.8 IS,(only if it wasn't that big)

Canon 70-200f4 IS ( only if it wasn't F4)

I am using a cropn body (30D) my next purchase will be the 7D

[Rainer]

I strongly recommend to give the EF 135/2L a try.

[joachim]

[quote name='toni-a' date='14 June 2010 - 12:35 PM' timestamp='1276515354' post='490']

Hi all,

bought 100 mm macro as a macro and portrait lens.

the lens is extremely sharp, merely flawless, I was happy with it, but I want more.



Only flaw is bokeh, i want a better bokeh.

on close focus distance (less than 2 meters) bokeh is amazing but when distance is longer things aren't that good, bokeh is still fine but not as good as I want.

so I am considering replacing it, since this is my mainly shooting.

my options

Canon 85mm f1.8 only if it manages to outperform the 100mm macro

Canon 100mm f2.8 macro L IS seems an obvious choice till now.

Canon 70-200f2.8 IS,(only if it wasn't that big)

Canon 70-200f4 IS ( only if it wasn't F4)

I am using a cropn body (30D) my next purchase will be the 7D

[/quote]



Hi Toni,



did you consider buying non Canon lenses?



Zeiss Planar 85/1.4: http://www.prime35.com/zeiss-planar-85mm-f1-4/



Please note, the samples are from the old CYMM lens not the new EF. Didn't find any EF samples uikly. Quite often "historic" lenses are better at what you ask. They won't deliver top MTF graphs, but who needs those in a portrait?



J.

[mst]

[quote name='toni-a' date='14 June 2010 - 12:35 PM' timestamp='1276515354' post='490']

on close focus distance (less than 2 meters) bokeh is amazing but when distance is longer things aren't that good, bokeh is still fine but not as good as I want.

[/quote]



Is it really bokeh that you're missing (the technical quality of background blur)? Or would you rather prefer more subject separation (more background blur)?



-- Markus

[toni-a]

@ Joachin: Manual focus lenses are out of questions, even non USM lenses are already ruled out.

@ Markus: I know I am asking too much, but I am upgrading already from an excellent lens, which I thought to make a logical compromise, it seems I need more than that.

[toni-a]

[quote name='Rainer' date='14 June 2010 - 04:55 PM' timestamp='1276523727' post='499']

I strongly recommend to give the EF 135/2L a try.

[/quote]

First lens that came to mind was this one, however since I am not going full frame this one seems a little too long for what I intend to use

[Rainer]

[quote name='toni-a' date='14 June 2010 - 09:11 PM' timestamp='1276542694' post='513']

First lens that came to mind was this one, however since I am not going full frame this one seems a little too long for what I intend to use

[/quote]



The alternative to it is a bit more costly ... the EF 85/1.2L

[toni-a]

[quote name='Rainer' date='14 June 2010 - 11:44 PM' timestamp='1276548275' post='515']

The alternative to it is a bit more costly ... the EF 85/1.2L

[/quote]



this lens is surely tempting, but for my needs its f1.8 sister is enough, did you own this lens ? does it outperform the 100 macro ??

[Rainer]

[quote name='toni-a' date='14 June 2010 - 10:53 PM' timestamp='1276548786' post='516']

this lens is surely tempting, but for my needs its f1.8 sister is enough, did you own this lens ? does it outperform the 100 macro ??

[/quote]



I couldn't convince myself to invest in the 85L ... I rather use the 85/1.8 + the 135L (but that is on fullframe).

But it is really tempting...I rented a 85L twice and always found it hard to return it to the shop.



But you ask for better bokeh ... the 85L is not likely to outperform a 100macro (regardles which) in

terms of image sharpness over the frame, but it will produce a nicer bokeh and blur in the conditions

you asked for (distances over 2 meters)

[wim]

[quote name='toni-a' date='14 June 2010 - 10:53 PM' timestamp='1276548786' post='516']

this lens is surely tempting, but for my needs its f1.8 sister is enough, did you own this lens ? does it outperform the 100 macro ??

[/quote]

No, the 85 F/1.8 doesn't. This, having owned three 85 F/1.8s, and the non-L 100 Macro (and tested the 100L Macro).



The bokeh of the L Macro is supposed to be quite a bit better, but to me it is too long for portraiture on APS-C unless there is plenty of space, and the testing that I did, didn't convince me either of its increase in IQ over the non-L macro, or supposedly clearly better bokeh either. Did you consider the 50L BTW? That would be a short tele on crop à la 85L on FF.



As I mentioned, I owned the 85 F/1.8, which I sold several months after acquiring an 85L II. It didn't get ant=y camera tiem anymore. I think the 85L II is great on APS-C, BTW, but a little long for standard portraits. Great for candid ones however.



Considering macro: after acquiring the 135L, already having the 50L, and a bunch of extension tubes, I actually sold both the 100 Macro and the 70-200 F/4L IS, basically because I found that for my purposes even for macro use the rendering of 50L and 135L with extension tubes easily beat the 100 macro, and the 100L Macro when I tested it, and the 70-200 just was not ll that good close to MFD (it is (too) soft close to MFD). The 135L with extender beats it easily.



The 50L and 135L both have something in common that not every lens has, that actually few lenses have, namely excellent fore- and background bokeh. F.e., the 85L mostly has excellent background bokeh, but certainly is less good with regard to the foreground in this respect. IMO, this is the main reason why 50L and 135L have more "pop" than most lenses.



HTH, kind regards, Wim