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Nikon Z launched
As an early adopter of both the Fuji NEX (NEX-5) and Fuji X-Mount (X-Pro1), I really recommend you skip the first generation... or two. No matter how many engineers a company has, or how good and long their testing is, many problems will not be fixed (or even spotted) until the product is released and in the hands of people using it to make a living.

Also, what lenses do you really want in that system? If you are invested in the Nikon F-mount, keep your DSLR for now.

If not, wait for Canon's answer.
(08-25-2018, 04:58 PM)davidmanze Wrote: Oh dear for the Tony and Chelsea review....................... I hope they had a dodgy copy!
I don't think the hardware is the biggest problem of the AF misses. Fuji did so much on firmware - if you try an X-T2 with FW 1.00 and one with 4.20, you will experience two very different cameras as soon as you try to make AF-C work. I also hope they stop this stupid closing down aperture to f/5.6 to focus.

But see for yourself: Put your D500 to LiveView and try to focus with AF-F. This is just the kind of experience I was hoping a dedicated "LiveView only" body will not show.

(08-25-2018, 05:12 PM)WyldRage Wrote: ...No matter how many engineers a company has, or how good and long their testing is, many problems will not be fixed (or even spotted) until the product is released and in the hands of people using it to make a living.

I think, Nikon was pushing very hard to make it to the jubilee date of their first FF DSLR, to try to come up with a MILC before Canon does and before photokina. But as you say, they could have taken longer testing periods, the risk of leaking product photos is very high. Rumour sites are on the watch and Nikon shooters waited for very long. I took my time with Fuji, get myself a bit informed and started very small with a X-E2, which now got firmware 4.11, X-T2 is on 4.20, meaning two things: It was well worth the investment, and Fuji messed up a couple of firmwares and needed to develop to this level of performance step by step. So far, Nikon was absolutely shy in terms of delivering new firmware or secure their customers investments.

At the moment Sendai factory makes 20.000 units per month. No matter how big the issues in the pre-production models are, preorders are floating in anyway.

(08-25-2018, 05:12 PM)WyldRage Wrote: Also, what lenses do you really want in that system? If you are invested in the Nikon F-mount, keep your DSLR for now.
I will keep the DLSRs, but a couple of benefits I hope to get even with Nikon's first attempt - after that, it's better to skip two generations.

(08-25-2018, 05:12 PM)WyldRage Wrote: If not, wait for Canon's answer.
I'm sceptical if Canon comes up with a flawless first body, a completer lens line - but I'm nearly sure their AF will be better
As more details of the Nikons keep piling in it is clear that there are many shortfalls with both models, some remediable in the way of FWs and some, that are inherent mechanical hardware limitations, that aren't.
The S6 is Nikon's ML answer to the D750........the 6.5 fps....... 14 bit..... twin slot SD........screen tilting 51 AF point lightest weight FF DSLR body... -4 EV low light AF...... that's now more than three years old.

Now it is way behind in terms of shooting speed......but wait..... reading between the available information.......it seems that the S6 is only 12 bit.......and wait again.....if you want continuous exposure in fast shooting you have to drop down to 5.5 fps. True, the AF coverage leaves the D750 is the dust, but it's not all good news, with the Northrups having all sorts of AF misses, far beyond anything seen on DSLRs.
So where are the ML advantages there? Do we just have to look out to it's video performance to enjoy any benefits?

It seems that the battery life will be much better than the quoted 330 shots (thank God) but it still won't match the D750 with it's OVF...... for my style of shooting I can spend hours looking through the VF and AFing constantly which gives much lower battery life........how will things go with ML?

There will be a string of models before Nikon catch Sony!
We actually see what's happening if marketing pushes a release date. And what's happening if Nikon gives out cameras with version 0.5 of firmware.

I heard an enjoyable YouTube Podcast, but beware! https://youtu.be/QKN68FwOkCM

He's a Sony user
He's talking while having a coffee. And it's a slide show with only one slide...
He's Dutch
He's one of the few persons not infected by the Zee hype and the hype of the hype of the hype
He's thinking (that's the weirdest part, I guess) the world will still keep on turning if Nikon manages to mess up gloriously, but as I said: Dutch. They apparently are all bit less easy to hype them seriously.
Seems too expensive. Will it really sell or will it die as fast as their last system ?
Who knows - my crystal ball is being serviced now, ETA unknown. Smile But it's always fun to watch a new system emerge (and not so fun to see it off into the sunset, as we have done to quite a few already), and if anything, it will help keep Sony on their toes.

The big question (perhaps not the $1 mln one, but certainly about the size of the $64K one) is... Markus, are you going to test the Z lenses? Or maybe even use a Zed (plus adapter) as the base for the high megapixel Nikon testing run? Smile
I've seen Markus' D850 now ... it exists ;-)

As for the Z7 - the jury is still out who's going to do it.
Chief Editor - opticallimits.com

Doing all things Canon, MFT, Sony and Fuji
Nikon just apologized.

Not for he missing second card slot. Only for not being able to fullfill all preorders... of the Zeeeeee and the new 500 mm.
More details here.

I have still no explains for it. They cut Nikon 1 also the Nikon DL line. dSLR sells are still droping.
What they are doing now?
@JJ_SO - you follow Nikon closely. Do you have any explanation?
I have no clue what is going on by Nikon..

PS: As Canon shutter I have expansion for D850 shortage. Nikon cannot make SLRs :-)
Fast google shows this
It seems that tjey are focusing on medical, and industrial sector.
First, I don't follow Nikon closely and have no account at Nikonians or Nikon rumours.
Second, you can't compare Series 1 with Z
Third I have no idea why you conclude about the numbers of one type of cameras to the numbers of the other type. If there's a decrase in bicycle sales it can mean the people are buying more pedelecs... I also bought enough DLSRs, over time I became just fed up with the time cosuming process of finetuning lenses which happens to be necessary
when I buy a new lens
when a lens or camera goes to service
when I buy a new (DSLR) camera
And fourth, why is Nikon's delayed decision to go mirrorless finally - which was expected for a long while - your concern? You think it might be better if they continue to sell DSLRs until all old DSLR buyers (not users, buyers) finally died? What else can Nikon do to continue making cameras? They will - as far as I interprete various informations - continue to make DSLRs - they just came out with a D3500 (entry levele). They tried to make a soft transition possible and I think the outcome is very okay. Over all this ado about only one card slot or slow AF with eye detect the news got lost that the sensor is slightly better than the alredy very good D850 sensor.

I don't understand why the mirrorless nature doesn't have a bigger impact on the camera price, but we got IBIS as a first in NIkon FX bodies.

The DL line was just another boring attempt to establish a high end compact which no one needed and suffered of overheating problems. The 1 series is another victim of Nikon's highly incapable marketing department and a toy of target group research projects. Obviously the researchers did a bad job. It's rather difficult to make a difference between the cameras and their quality and the advertisment group - same brand but maybe different targets.

You see, miro, I'm not happy with everything Nikon does. Most of their decisions are disappointing or weird, but they still know how to make cameras and lenses. Smile
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