I am looking to find a camera that I can keep in the pocket allways. Not when I do a reportage, or shoot architechture, fashion, portraits, whatever, but in the best Cartier Bresson tradition photograph people or situations at a moments notice, without being seen or at least not being seen before the image has been taken.
It seems to me that it is not a DSLR, but an expert compact, small enough at least to fit in a jacket pocket and advanced enough to adjust it the way I would an DSLR. Whoever does this for a living will surely choose a Leica M9, but for the rest of us, who may not have 5.500€ to spend on a housing, plus whatever on the lenses, there must still be a good choice. Samsung, Panasonic, Canon, Olympus, Fuji, Sony, even Nikon has put cameras on the market recently that might fit the bill. I think I would want a camera with a permanent lens, thereby mking it even more compact and simple.
Which one would you choose and why?
[quote name='Vieux loup' timestamp='1301322165' post='7168']
I am looking to find a camera that I can keep in the pocket allways. Not when I do a reportage, or shoot architechture, fashion, portraits, whatever, but in the best Cartier Bresson tradition photograph people or situations at a moments notice, without being seen or at least not being seen before the image has been taken.
It seems to me that it is not a DSLR, but an expert compact, small enough at least to fit in a jacket pocket and advanced enough to adjust it the way I would an DSLR. Whoever does this for a living will surely choose a Leica M9, but for the rest of us, who may not have 5.500€ to spend on a housing, plus whatever on the lenses, there must still be a good choice. Samsung, Panasonic, Canon, Olympus, Fuji, even Nikon has put cameras on the market recently that might fit the bill.
Which one would you choose and why?
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The Canon Powershot G12 is the best compact digital on the whole. A bit more pocketable, two other great compacts: Canon Powershot S95 and Panasonic LX5.
Less pocketable: the cameras with bigger sensors.
Sigma DP1/2 series, Panasonic GF1/2, Fuji X100, Olympus PEN series, Samsung NX, Sony NEX3/5.
More expensive range finders: APS-C Epson RD1-series, 1.3x APS-H Leica M8, 135 format FF Leica M9.
What fits your ideas bets can only be answered by you.... Which focal length do you envision you will like best? Which of the cameras then offers you the lens you want/like? Do you want to shoot with the camera at your eye, or at arm's length? Does a 3x4 format bother you, or not? How big is your pocket?
For super compact digital, my choice would be either LX5 or S95, both have their charm. The G12 is my choice of best compact digital. DP1/2 are too cumbersome for me. RD1 is hard to get, but a really charming camera. I do not like 4/3rds aspect ratio. I do not like NEX3/5 concept. NX... maybe a future model, I don't like the Nx10 (too big for what it is supposed to be). The Fuji X100 is the most charming of them to me, but you will have to like the lens that it comes with as it is not exchangable.
In short, the right more compact camera for street shooting does not exist yet, for me.
To make it clearer, I would like a lens that is permanent, fast and not necessarily a zoom. But a 35-100mm zoom would fit the bill. If I need to change lenses, I'd rather take my D700 with a 35mm mounted. Some of you must have tried the most recent comers on the market, Olympus XZ 1, Nikon P7000, Canon S95, Lumix LX5, etc. I can read the reviews myself, I would like hands on experience.
Well, hands-on : I bought the Oly Pen EP1 for this kind of usage, ended selling it at a loss not so long ago <img src='http://forum.photozone.de/public/style_emoticons/<#EMO_DIR#>/tongue.gif' class='bbc_emoticon' alt='  ' /> Disappointing AF and although the sensor wasn't so bad I wasn't entirely happy with the camera, it proved too cumbersome to use with AF that was a PITA <img src='http://forum.photozone.de/public/style_emoticons/<#EMO_DIR#>/smile.gif' class='bbc_emoticon' alt='  ' /> Maybe I'm used too much to the SLR ergonomics to enjoy a compact anymore.. ? <img src='http://forum.photozone.de/public/style_emoticons/<#EMO_DIR#>/tongue.gif' class='bbc_emoticon' alt=' ' />
Sorry I can't be positive about recommending anything in this category, although I think I would look at the Fuji X100 or a future Sony Nex with a 24mm lens (rumors are this is coming out soon) but only if I find it responsive enough especially AF-wise. Why those ? Becouse of a very decent APS-C sensors and I don't mind beeing restricted to 24mm in APS-C territory for street and landscape usage.
The first thing you have to realize that compared to a D700 it is a compromise, whatever you chose.
Next step is probably to get a Canon G-series camera, and which one of the newer ones doesn't matter too much unless you want specific options like a tiltable screen. I say this because a an image from a G10 is just as "noiseless" as an image from a G11 or G12 at the same magnification <img src='http://forum.photozone.de/public/style_emoticons/<#EMO_DIR#>/biggrin.gif' class='bbc_emoticon' alt='  ' />.
If you want an even smaller camera, an S95, LX-3 or LX-5 will do very nicely indeed.
The best will be a Leica M9, but that is substantially bigger, and also is more than substantially more expensive <img src='http://forum.photozone.de/public/style_emoticons/<#EMO_DIR#>/biggrin.gif' class='bbc_emoticon' alt=' ' />.
Personally, I have a G10, basically because I like the controls, and because I tried the G11 and G12, and realized I didn't need to upgrade yet. As to the smaller cameras, but that is very personal, I think they are too small.
I own a "manbag", which I have with me wherever I go, and that is what I use to carry the G10, so that I always have a camera with me, even if I don't have my normal bag with me (f.e., on my weekly shop).
HTH, kind regards, Wim
Gear: Canon EOS R with 3 primes and 2 zooms, 4 EF-R adapters, Canon EOS 5 (analog), 9 Canon EF primes, a lone Canon EF zoom, 2 extenders, 2 converters, tubes; Olympus OM-D 1 Mk II & Pen F with 12 primes, 6 zooms, and 3 Metabones EF-MFT adapters ....
Thank you for your input <img src='http://forum.photozone.de/public/style_emoticons/<#EMO_DIR#>/smile.gif' class='bbc_emoticon' alt=' ' /> Has any of you tried the P7000? It is a little bigger, has an optical wiever and gets very good grades for image quality and AF, a little less so for ergonomics and responsiveness, but it has a nice lens and of course produces .NEF files, which would make post production simpler for me. There is also the P300 which has a super fast 24-100 lens, but does not produce raw files. Wim, I like your idea of always having a small bag with me, it eliminates the necessity for a "pocketable" camera, even if it should be compact.
[quote name='Vieux loup' timestamp='1301350837' post='7190']
Thank you for your input <img src='http://forum.photozone.de/public/style_emoticons/<#EMO_DIR#>/smile.gif' class='bbc_emoticon' alt=' ' /> Has any of you tried the P7000? It is a little bigger, has an optical wiever and gets very good grades for image quality and AF, a little less so for ergonomics and responsiveness, but it has a nice lens and of course produces .NEF files, which would make post production simpler for me. There is also the P300 which has a super fast 24-100 lens, but does not produce raw files. Wim, I like your idea of always having a small bag with me, it eliminates the necessity for a "pocketable" camera, even if it should be compact.
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The P7000 is not a little bigger, is is almost an exact copy of the design of the G9/10/11/12, but it is in fact more compact and lighter.
Both have an optical viewfinder too.
But when reviewers note:
"I'm not one to use car analogies in camera reviews, but I can't help but feel that one is appropriate here. Imagine if Porsche designed a beautiful sports car, equipping it with cutting-edge features -- and then put a lawn mower engine in it. That's the Coolpix P7000, in a nutshell. It has a ton of features, very good photo quality, manual controls, and plenty of optional extras. Unfortunately, the camera's user interface is so slow that using the P7000 is an exercise in frustration, rather than a pleasure."
(dcresource)
"A wait of almost 2 seconds to return to shooting mode from a menu screen is too long. A pause of more than a second to scroll from one image to the next in review mode (histogram view) is also too long. Likewise the camera's unpredictable response to control inputs; sometimes the P7000 responds to a single click of one of the two control wheels, and sometimes it doesn't. 'Button lag' where the camera always seems to be one step behind whatever you just asked it to do is a depressing feature of older digicams and some current budget models, but we didn't expect to see it in a $500 high-end compact. Unfortunately it is a feature of the P7000, and that is very disappointing."
(dpreview)
"Where I grew frustrated using the Nikon P7000 was its overall sluggish performance. I used the camera to shoot the annual Medieval Festival in New York City, the Balloon Fiesta in New Mexico, and leaf-peeping season in Vermont. While the image quality was solid--more of which I'll discuss further down in this report--I was disappointed with how slowly the camera responded."
(Imaging resource)
you just know it has one big drawback... very slow computer/GUI. No "have you guys used it" is going to change that. For the rest, it is a nice camera, just like the G11/12 are nice cameras.
I would concentrate on what features are actually important... is an optical view finder important? Then get a G11/12 or a P7000 if you like sluggish controls. If small size more important? Then get a S95/LX or even a XZ1. Or a P300, in the hope that it is faster in operation.
In my opinion, that is more important than what RAW converter you will use.
I used to have Canon G10 before Panasonic GF1. Obviously it's a 100% personal opinion, but these were incomparable to me. G10 was just a big, slow, overpriced point-and-shoot camera, miles behind GF1 + 20mm 1.7 combo.
Nikon does not have the best reputation in the compact camera segment (to put it mildly). If a compact camera is what you're after, you're probably better off with a G12 than with a P7000. Even the NEF argument is not really valid, since the file format varies with every camera. So, you'd have to check whether your RAW converter supports the P7000 (or any other compact camera that produces RAW files).
Don't expect too much from the optical viewfinders in these cameras. They're small and dark and only give a very rough estimate of the frame coverage.
In addition, these cameras aren't really small (compared to the rest of the segment). If size matters, I'd rather choose a LX-5 or a S95 (which is already too small for my taste).
However, for the intended usage you'll probably prefer a more "capable" camera. Especially if you plan to use the limited DOF potential of fast glass. The obvious candidates here are the GF-1 (with 20/1.7) or the Sony NEX. If you don't mind a fixed focal length, the Fuji X100 is certainly an attractive option, too.
There's one camera not mentioned, yet, that is also the closest match to a M9: a used M8. Gives you the largest sensor, however make sure to get familiar with the Pros and Cons of a rangefinder in general as well as the issues specific to the M8 before you choose that route.
-- Markus
Editor
opticallimits.com
If you don´t insist on a viewfinder take the GF1/20mm, f1.7 combo. If you want to spend less and/or something more pocketable look for the Canon S95 or the Pana LX5. "Unique selling points" of the LX5: 24mm wide (28mm S95), a good stop faster than the S95 at the long end of the zoom range, "multi-aspect sensor" lets you switch between 4/3; 3/2; 16/9 formats without loosing too many pixels. Video with the LX5 is jolly good too. USP of the S95: even smaller than the LX5, better JPGs, cheaper.
Look in my "LX5"-gallery for some sample images.
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