Hi Serkan,
[quote name='PuxaVida' date='18 July 2010 - 07:02 PM' timestamp='1279472524' post='1103']
Thank for the additional info Wim... Do they "leak" or rather overflow to the nearest pixel? Because if these pixels have holes in their walls, then this is nothing but a sabotage of high quality tonal range by the manifacturer himself![[Image: blink.gif]](http://forum.photozone.de/public/style_emoticons/default/blink.gif)
. And if it's an overflow, than I think the micro lenses must be able to take care of this issue... Am I asking too much from the manifacturers... it's just a special type of coating over the lens which gets light in but not out ![[Image: tongue.gif]](http://forum.photozone.de/public/style_emoticons/default/tongue.gif)
...[/quote]
I am afraid you are asking too much <img src='http://forum.photozone.de/public/style_emoticons/<#EMO_DIR#>/biggrin.gif' class='bbc_emoticon' alt='
' />.
All this stuff is so incredibly small, that something has to give. This happens at the micro structure level of the chip if you like, and the A/D conversion is another place where things like this happen. This, BTW, is no different from the analog days, just that almost nobody noticed it <img src='http://forum.photozone.de/public/style_emoticons/<#EMO_DIR#>/biggrin.gif' class='bbc_emoticon' alt='' />. Both the film, exposing it, and the development process contributed to noise and artefacts. However, the algorithms to get rid of it were less complex <img src='http://forum.photozone.de/public/style_emoticons/<#EMO_DIR#>/biggrin.gif' class='bbc_emoticon' alt='' />.
Not necessarily. It really all is about the printing, or display medium, and what you want recorded there. Photographic paper only has a DR of about 5 or maybe 6 stops, the best inkjet papers maybe slightly more. It is really all about what you find most important and what you want to be visible with regard to DR on this limited medium.
This means that you really have to think beforehand what to do, how to approach it. That is what the Zone System is all about.. What has to go in the middle ranges, Zone V etc., and what in Zone 2, Zone 8, etc., and how do you deal with the rest. Essentially you compress the DR so that it fits in the tonal scale you are using to show the finished image.
Current slrs all more or less have a similar DR to film, if not slightly more, so that hasn't changed. With film you would expose for a specific film development process that you used to convert what you saw in the field to what you wanted to show. Overexposing and underdeveloping to compress the DR, underexposing and overdeveloping to stretch it, specifically for that which you wanted to show in the final photograph. It's slightly more complicated than that, but this was what it was about. You effectively manipulate the resulting tonal S-curve so that it fits that what you visualized and what you want printed on the lower DR medium.
This is no different from what you want to do with digital, just that digital doesn't take well to overexposing, and film doesn't do well to underexposing. Other than that, the principle is really the same, the way I see it. Just that the method to apply this differs - computer vs darkroom.
Kind regards, Wim
[quote name='PuxaVida' date='18 July 2010 - 07:02 PM' timestamp='1279472524' post='1103']
Thank for the additional info Wim... Do they "leak" or rather overflow to the nearest pixel? Because if these pixels have holes in their walls, then this is nothing but a sabotage of high quality tonal range by the manifacturer himself
. And if it's an overflow, than I think the micro lenses must be able to take care of this issue... Am I asking too much from the manifacturers... it's just a special type of coating over the lens which gets light in but not out ...[/quote]I am afraid you are asking too much <img src='http://forum.photozone.de/public/style_emoticons/<#EMO_DIR#>/biggrin.gif' class='bbc_emoticon' alt='
' />.All this stuff is so incredibly small, that something has to give. This happens at the micro structure level of the chip if you like, and the A/D conversion is another place where things like this happen. This, BTW, is no different from the analog days, just that almost nobody noticed it <img src='http://forum.photozone.de/public/style_emoticons/<#EMO_DIR#>/biggrin.gif' class='bbc_emoticon' alt='
' />. Both the film, exposing it, and the development process contributed to noise and artefacts. However, the algorithms to get rid of it were less complex <img src='http://forum.photozone.de/public/style_emoticons/<#EMO_DIR#>/biggrin.gif' class='bbc_emoticon' alt='' />.Quote:Both the zone system and HDR require a recording medium with high dynamic/tonal range for best results. If all you have for the net is the 8 bit JPEGs, what can you do? Producing high quality images always come with a price: they're not easily portable (which is not an issue for me personally... most of the time it's enough for me to see them on my screen)...
King regards,
Serkan
Not necessarily. It really all is about the printing, or display medium, and what you want recorded there. Photographic paper only has a DR of about 5 or maybe 6 stops, the best inkjet papers maybe slightly more. It is really all about what you find most important and what you want to be visible with regard to DR on this limited medium.
This means that you really have to think beforehand what to do, how to approach it. That is what the Zone System is all about.. What has to go in the middle ranges, Zone V etc., and what in Zone 2, Zone 8, etc., and how do you deal with the rest. Essentially you compress the DR so that it fits in the tonal scale you are using to show the finished image.
Current slrs all more or less have a similar DR to film, if not slightly more, so that hasn't changed. With film you would expose for a specific film development process that you used to convert what you saw in the field to what you wanted to show. Overexposing and underdeveloping to compress the DR, underexposing and overdeveloping to stretch it, specifically for that which you wanted to show in the final photograph. It's slightly more complicated than that, but this was what it was about. You effectively manipulate the resulting tonal S-curve so that it fits that what you visualized and what you want printed on the lower DR medium.
This is no different from what you want to do with digital, just that digital doesn't take well to overexposing, and film doesn't do well to underexposing. Other than that, the principle is really the same, the way I see it. Just that the method to apply this differs - computer vs darkroom.
Kind regards, Wim
Gear: Canon EOS R with 3 primes and 2 zooms, 4 EF-R adapters, Canon EOS 5 (analog), 9 Canon EF primes, a lone Canon EF zoom, 2 extenders, 2 converters, tubes; Olympus OM-D 1 Mk II & Pen F with 12 primes, 6 zooms, and 3 Metabones EF-MFT adapters ....