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Nikon mirrorless system end of the month ???
#11
(07-06-2018, 10:38 AM)JJ_SO Wrote:
(07-06-2018, 09:03 AM)Klaus Wrote: Well, with that amount of lenses, it'll be for fanboys only in the beginning.
Rubbish. It depends how well the DSLR lenses will be adapted and soon the cameras will be for everybody (owning Nikon and) shooting often in LiveView or tethered or using it for portrait work. People who still have a bunch of Nikon manual focus glasses. Sorry to sound like a fanboy, I have more concerns about the success but missing lens choice is the least.

I see them as something interesting for people already in the Nikon system. My doubts are:
The first models will come with shortcomings, miss modern features, very probably can't compete with state of the art ML AF - so what reasons should one have to go Nikon instead Sony?
That Nikon is able to do something mirrorless - the 1 system is the proof. Unfortunately also the proof of solid misconceptions. Will they mess up less big time with FF?
Can we expect more than traditional ideas? 95% sure NO
A Kaizen concept like Fuji has to at least make the investment a bit more valuable?
A touchscreen which works well - and more important a better interface?
Better WiFI app?
Enough battery capacity and maybe someone at Nikon found out that USB can be used to charge a camera?
Seeing how Nikon goes the simplest and most expensive, yet wobbly way to design battery grips, can we hope for a useful one with added functionality?
How big will be the video shortcomings?

I don't even dream of Arca compatible bottom and side plate or of infrared focus patterns, of a menu system adjustable on a tablet or PC instead of the tiny screen, a real useful tilt/swift display. Knowing Nikon they will just stuck to their traditions and erase the mirror... But I'm open to surprises.

Adapters are and always will be an excuse but not an argument.
An adapter is always a compromise. Back in the days I also used an adapter on the Sony NEX. That adapter transformed the camera into a Sony SLT with essentially no AF penalty compared to the native SLTs. Even so it was just nothing short of alien and utterly pointless compared to native lenses. DSLR lenses just felt ridiculously large and unbalanced on the body.

Is that adapter relevant to Sony users today? No, it obviously isn't. 
Are FT-adapters relevant to MFT user today? Nope.
Do Fuji users care? No.
It may be that a few users use adapters for exotic lenses but these 3 systems are pretty much complete. There is just no need anymore for legacy lenses.

If you really buy this Nikon camera from day one, you are a fanboy. If you wanted to use Nikkors on a mirrorless camera, you could have done so for years - there's a Nikon AF-S adapter for Sony E mount adapter after all.

Anyway, there's nothing wrong about having a brand-affinity.
Chief Editor - opticallimits.com

Doing all things Canon, MFT, Sony and Fuji
#12
   Nikon ......."the rebirth" ...........with three lenses and two bodies..........


Man, have Nikon got some ML work to do!
Dave's clichés
#13
Klaus, all the brands you listed WERE incomplete at day one (maybe not as incomplete as the Nikons are rumored). So, at the beginning and from the start, these adapters played and still play a role (in GFX system is also enough empty space in the line-up to justify fringer adapters). And what about the speed-boosters for µ4/3?

Sony never would have had the success without (!) adapters. And as a Canon, Olympus/Panasonic and Fuji tester you don't know Nikon menus very well. Consistency, comprehendible logic is not perfect, but way better than the one I know from Fuji or Sony. I didn't switch to Nikon 1 (which you also forgot to mention in terms of adapters) because I needed lowlight capable sensor(size). Paying high prices for a tiny body with shortcomings? Flagship camera always changed design in each iteration?

Same for µ4/3, lowlight is just not the field they excel. Fuji complete? Really? Where are the long tele primes? The 200/2 is a start after a long wait. The 16-50 as a "Bread and butter" lens? Check the test results...

Sony's line-up may have been more complete, but lensrental's lens teardowns (at the beginning), reports of bad and/or expensive service plus quality issues put some question marks on my "switch-to" list. Today it's different but I don't feel in a rush to decide. Let's see what Nikon draws out of the hat before we judge. I'm pretty sure I will not buy a mirrorless Nikon at day one. They messed up the 1 system and they still have the same old heads in management, so all chances to mess up their new attempt as well. But none of the systems you listed is a valid alternative to me. Canon EOS? That's only a matter of taste, I find the bodies ugly as hell. But their concept works for a majority of users so it can't be wrong. Fuji? So many quirks really spoil my fun with their system. Going Sony and let a couple of Sigmas getting changed the mount? Maybe. First I'd like to rent one. Difficult as the items are in high demand (I wonder why...)
#14
Back then you had no alternatives when you wanted to complement your mirrorless setup. The thing is - today you have thus the situation is totally different.

If you like to bother with adapters - go ahead - but please don't try telling us that this is mainstream in the year 2018. ;-)
Chief Editor - opticallimits.com

Doing all things Canon, MFT, Sony and Fuji
#15
I wouldn't mind adapters, for MF lenses, for AF lenses, in the case electronics don't differ and SLR lens would act as it were on SLR for instance canon EF lenses on EFM, then why not ?
#16
(07-07-2018, 09:12 AM)Klaus Wrote: Back then you had no alternatives when you wanted to complement your mirrorless setup. The thing is - today you have thus the situation is totally different.

If you like to bother with adapters - go ahead - but please don't try telling us that this is mainstream in the year 2018. ;-)

What was I telling? For sure nothing about what's mainstream.

You know pretty well I'm a fan of Sigma - or say "I prefer their lenses to genuine ones in most cases". It's a matter of time until Sigma will offer a mount conversion service for the new Nikon ML mount, as they already do for CaNikon to Sony. Until that happens I like to keep the lenses I'm happy with, enjoy two very good FF bodies and use the Fuji for some stuff it does really well enough. I repeat: I'm in no rush at all to change system. And observe what users have to tell about Nikon ML.

"You had no alternatives" - sure? Why not stick with the system already in the bag? Today, I don't see a clear majority of advantages to any system. Downsides can be found in any of them.

This week I'm in Holland again with lots of lowlight situations. When I had to decide which system to take with me, I went the heavy way. I still haven't replaced the 56/1.2 APD (which is a total rubbish in lowlight), so no fast portrait. Also no light 300/4 (or equivalent 200/2.8) and worse of all: High ISO up to 25 k is useless on Fuji. Easy decision - in mind, but not in the bag...

Missed shots? Sure, but no more than with Fuji - and the good ones are simply better. Battery life? After 500 pictures still 1/3 of the first battery left...
#17
If you have a decent range of Nikon lenses and you want to go mirror-less (for whatever reason) you can sell your lenses on ebay (or wherever) and lose yourself a colossal bunch of money................. and struggle to feel good about life!

If you have a decent range of Canon glass you can buy yourself a Sony and the appropriate adapter and get full feature usage on your A7 or whatever.

At the moment you get very poor performance with Nikkor lenses on Sony so you are forced to buy new lenses.

If Nikon produces a good adapter, which given it's their proprietary mount should not cause problem, then you will be able to use Nikkor glass on your new Nikon ML.........



All of a sudden those "oh so lowly adapters" look like they have been heaven sent!

How else are you going to take pictures with your favourite wide aperture focal length lens........wait a few years while Nikon gets round to producing one?

I find it puzzling that given a new ML camera everybody assumes we are going to rush out ten grand plus on lenses!

Adapters are essential at the launch of a new ML when the lenses are just not there otherwise!
Dave's clichés
#18
The thing is - Nikon Z is a different system than Nikon F. Nikon CX had nothing to do with F mount either.
Same goes for Canon EOS M vs EOS EF(-S).

Nikon Z will start with 2 cameras and 3 lenses - I wouldn't even call that a system. No ultra-wide options and no tele lenses at all.
I'm sure that Nikon Z will reach greatness ... in 3-5 years ... but not at launch.
Chief Editor - opticallimits.com

Doing all things Canon, MFT, Sony and Fuji
#19
If the rumours are true we will know soon enough how good the camera and it's lens system is.

If nothing else it will be revealing!
Dave's clichés
#20
(07-08-2018, 11:19 AM)davidmanze Wrote: If the rumours are true we will know soon enough how good the camera and it's lens system is.

      If nothing else it will be revealing!

Whatever mount it'll have - it'll not be F mount, otherwise they would be doomed.
Pentax tried to keep the mount in the K-01 and we know how that went.
Chief Editor - opticallimits.com

Doing all things Canon, MFT, Sony and Fuji
  


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